878. - Roddy Bottum

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcast. or watch on YouTube. How long gone? It is your fearless co-host, Chris Black. I'm in Chicago, Jason, and there's hella snow on the ground, was only mentally prepared for it. How else could you really prepare for it? Physically, I wasn't ready to brace. I'm wearing boots, but the step in the snow, this is something you don't experience that much, thank God. You're lucky. I chose not to go to Chicago today, but that's just on me. In life in general, you've been able to avoid snow by living in Los Angeles. Has it ever snowed there? Not actual real snow. I mean, there's been times where I was in elementary school and the teacher will be like, it's snowing, and then everyone screams and runs outside, but then there'll be one single snowflake that you could watch turn to water in front of your eyes. Immediately as soon as it touches the ground, but I'm saying so. Oh, it doesn't make the ground, honey. I'm staying at an undisclosed hotel that Katie loves. And so the band is staying here. I was like, sure, I'll be a team player. You know, Jason, I'm not as much of a snob as you, even though I get a bad rap. But I'm sitting in my room. Are you a team player or are you a cosplayer? Both. Depending on the situation, I'm both. I just thought it would be funny, you know, whatever. And I get here and I was joking that I needed Jimmy John's for lunch to solve my travel day.

And this hotel is situated in something I've never seen before. It's almost like they plopped a three-star hotel in a food court. So I'm looking out the window, and it's five guys. Oh, sorry, five guys at the restaurant, not just five guys. There's also five guys, actually, but they're in moose knuckles jackets in front of the five guys. So we got five guys. We got Buffalo Wild Wings. We got Auntie Annie's. We got Starbucks, Jimmy John's, Smoothie King, Panda Express, Slotsky's Deli. as well as a store I've never heard of before, Scrub Depot, where you get all of your scrubs if you work in the medical field. It's one of the most twisted things I've ever seen. Scrub Depot. That's where you found your man. You're a fool for that one. That is interesting because whenever we stay in Chicago, whenever you're traveling with me, we like to be over at the Waldorf. and there is a jimmy johns in the sub floor of that location remember that's that's also you're right actually and i did forget this one i had i had to traipse outside um through a small amount of snow um when we're over at the when i'm over at the at the waldorf you know you look out the window oh there's the bottega store there's the prada store there's this and that go around the corner nice joe and the juice get a little tuna melt Sorry, Joe and the Juice, that's on Starbucks level. Let's not put Joe and the Juice on the same level as designer stores in the Gold Coast. Let's be respectful. I think healthy travelers know that Joe and the Juice is a great resource. Joe and the Juice is one of the worst. I mean, ask Diplo. Obviously, I don't want to go there, but if it's that or... five guys jimmy john's panda express or whatever oh jimmy john's a hundred times i know but if you want if you want to be a healthy healthy eater you can go to jimmy what's healthy what's healthy about joe and the juice you can get smoothies juices coffees alternative milks you can get those juices don't feel like juice to me if you know what i'm saying it feels more like mixers from the club no this shit is scandinavian in origin they don't play with that shit bro

Hey, it is Scandinavian by blood, and they do not play with that shit, bro. Show me the lie, bro. Show me the lie. That's true. I haven't pulled up the car facts on Joe and the Juice. And obviously, like I said, this is a desperate traveler's resource. Yeah, this is when under- I mean, I watched a little interview or something like that with a friend of the show, Diplo, and he said when he's traveling, that's what he does. He hits a little Joe in the juice. He can get a little something, something. Oh, great. Put something clean in the stomach. Whatever Diplo's doing is what I want to be doing. Because he's rich and he stayed out of jail. So I guess I'm going to take a second look at Joe in the juice. He eats a lot of avocados for his complexion. If he would chill out on the run clubs, he'd be the perfect guy. But he just can't help himself. You know what I mean? Everyone has that one little thing that ruins them. Totally. Totally. I'm not above it. I'm not above it. I've been seeing all these year-end lists coming out, Jason. and trickling out. It is that perfect combination of things I really like, things I don't like, and things I've absolutely never heard of. That, to me, makes up the perfect list. I don't know how you feel. I agree with you on that, but I guess when I was maybe under 33 years old, the amount of things on those lists that I didn't know were closer to zero than they are now. Yeah, but I think everything's gotten a little crazier. What do you mean by that? I just mean there's a lot more music than there was 10 years ago, 15 years ago. Yeah, less of the monoculture. When you see the pitchfork list, you can expect, you know, the standard, the arcade fires and your beach houses and your this and your that. And then one or two curveballs, you know, like, oh, we did a really freaky Erykah Badu album that nobody ever... knew it even came out but they give it number four you know that kind of thing yeah it feels a little more but now and now it's so now it truly is everything and you have to do one album or one song or one jacket or one book out of every category there's just too many categories now yeah there's way too many fucking categories that's it that's a good way to put it i've learned about some new stuff um and i've also learned that the the passion people have

for the band geese is something that i wish um i could inspire in anyone and i don't think i'm ever going to achieve that in my adult life what is what is it about these geese huh like i said before it reminds me of early radio head fever yeah no no i i don't i don't know what it is necessarily i just think that also i saw that somebody was saying smurs has a one of the members of smurs has a dad that's in nato i guess Second NATO reference on the pod this week. Which I wasn't aware of. I didn't do any research on that. I just saw that in a tweet, and I thought that was pretty funny. I don't know what that's supposed to signify. Are they trying to make Nepo claims? Because that's not really. That's a little different. Yeah, that could be a reverse Nepo, actually. Who knows? That could work. It's something that you'd want to perhaps hide. But I guess I know they're from Copenhagen. I think they're from... I feel like they're from Oslo. But whatever, they're Scandinavian. They're up in there. Like Joe and the Jews, they're Scandinavian blood. Yeah, they're – I don't know. I mean, I know that NATO – I don't know really what they're doing up in there, helping out Ukraine. I don't know what – Let me – Testing out quantum technologies in Copenhagen. I'm Googling. Smurfs, dad, NATO. There's a NATO accelerator test site. Don't worry. Yeah, right. You already know what the business is. Jens Stoltenberg is the daughter of Norwegian politician and former NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg. Okay. All right. Well, you can have whatever since you want. I don't know. We're not getting a new 808. We're getting the original. I like it, though, because you immediately. You look at tweets like Sophie Kemp. There's a tweet from a month ago that says, I love that the girl in Smur's dad controls NATO. Do you see how quickly this spins out of control? He's the minister of finance. I don't know if that's controlling NATO necessarily, but it's a fun little tidbit. He's not picking enemies out of the sky. No, no, no, no, no. He's definitely at a desk wearing a suit. It's not. But I love that this is what people...

really choose to get worked up about, you know, and, and the, and the sort of also people like to get worked up about the sort of technicality of things where it's like, well, that was actually released in December of 2024. So can it count? And it's, it's once again, it's meanwhile, Kendrick Lamar is up for best new artists this year. His new record. Damn is up for. album of the album of the year once again damn is coming coming through yeah i i don't really i don't really understand how that stuff works but it reminds me of when like there was a kid in your grade that was a little older than you because he you know the cutoff was was was sort of you know pulled out of the it doesn't really make a lot of sense necessarily but it has to exist i guess feels similar to that where i'm not so many things i'm not going to judge you know i'm not going to judge these rules i don't make them i don't i don't work at stereo gum or pitchfork so i don't really care there are no more rules anymore that's what's dope about media uh let's see here we're we're gonna go to war with venezuela maybe soon but more importantly netflix has a ditty docuseries coming out today i don't i i weirdly could not care less about it for some reason you're still gonna watch it though no i don't think i will i don't i don't really watch stuff like that like i don't care i i watched kevin hart's stand-up special um because i hate myself but i but yeah i don't okay you don't have a little leg to stand on uh i don't why did you watch that It's quiet for a little cat. I find him really annoying. I got to say, he had a pretty good pair of pants on. I was surprised because I didn't know they made him in his size. But it's a nice pair of pants. But no, I don't. It's not funny. I don't know. I just do. Because that to me, like a Diddy thing from like 50 Cent making a spite doc. Obviously, I respect it from a pettiness level. There's no one better at it. But it doesn't make me want to actually watch it because I don't care what happens. Do you know what I'm saying? I don't care what information is there because I don't care about Diddy. I don't really care anymore. It's over. But during these trying times when we'll watch documentaries about just truly any old bullshit, as long as it's a captivating, well-made doc, we'll watch a documentary about a meth head in Florida who...

Has tigers or whatever. But that's more captivating because that's not a story I already sort of know. You know what I mean? It's like so out of the blue that it feels like that's why it captures. I also love it when a story, I don't know how a story is going to end. And we know how the Diddy story is probably going to end based on living in current present time and everything. But, you know, hopefully 50 doesn't let us down. I know that there's. There's a NS Variety magazine says an NSFW interview with a gigolo who did freak offs for eight years. Details. Eight years. Damn. Details his sexual marathons paying tribute to Biggie's death. Whoa. Nothing says pay tribute to my death more like a freak off. All right. I guess we have a guest today. Roddy Bottom is joining us. His book, The Royal We, is out now everywhere. You might know him from his musical endeavors. He was in Faith No More. He's put out a bunch of stuff. He's scored a bunch of things as well. Imperial Teen. Let's tap in with Roddy and see what's really good. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace. Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web, so do all our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues, maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world... writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly, a website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded. Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools. So those future graduates can find me and, you know, I'm able to accept, quote, unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new, you know, 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. You know, show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early. And we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional.

as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash howlong for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code howlong to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. Oh, this is huge for me personally. This episode of How I'm Gone is brought to you by TaskRabbit. Oh, baby, let me tell you something. This is not a joke. I use TaskRabbit a lot. because I can't do anything. You need some art hung, TaskRabbit. You need a fucking something put together, a cabinet. Got to reach that cheese grater on the top shelf. TaskRabbit. Anything you need, TaskRabbit can take care of it for you. And I mean, how it works, TaskRabbit connects you with skilled taskers in your area. They can help you move. They can assemble furniture. repairs, yard work, mounting, and more. You can search for a Tasker based on cost, skill set, availability, and past client reviews so you know exactly who's showing up and can have confidence that they know what they're doing because Taskers have assembled over 3.4 million pieces of furniture, completed 700,000 home repairs, handled 1.5 million moves, and the numbers are just going up, Jason. Yeah, throw a little money at the problem. It's not so expensive, and that job that you really don't want to do is something that another person out in the world, is very good at doing and would gladly do it in exchange for a little bit of money. So when life happens, your to-do list grows. Get ahead of it now and get $15 off your first task at TaskRabbit.com or grab the TaskRabbit app. using promo code howlong. Taskers book up faster, especially for same-day tasks. So book Trusted Home Help today. That is $15 off your first task using promo code howlong with the TaskRabbit app or at TaskRabbit.com. How are you guys? We're good. Sorry, I was stuck on the tarmac at beautiful O'Hare, so thank you for being able to adjust by one hour. I appreciate it. Oh, yeah, no problem. What was going on in Chicago? I'm here for a show, but I guess there was a plane that just refused to leave its gate. A tale as old as time, but there's snow on the ground, so I feel like I'm in winter mode now. I've switched off. I forgot my earmuffs, but here we are. So you're in Chicago now, Chris? That's right.

I'm in Chicago as we speak. You can't tell by the depressing low-end hotel decor? Well, I can tell it's a hotel, but I can't get any city vibe from it. How about you, Jason? Where are you at? I'm at home in Glendale, California. Glendale, nice. Are you in New York? No, you know where I am? It's crazy. I'm in Provincetown. Do you guys know what that is? Yeah, we're honorary gays. Yeah. Despite our heterosexuality, we are very familiar with Provincetown. You're aware of Provincetown because it is very gay. For you listeners who don't know, it's the tip, tippity tip of the very end of Cape Cod. Did you have to say tippity tip? Yeah, very, very tip. Okay, so they get the Cape Cod and they stretch the skin out and then it just gets to the very tippity tip top. Yeah, right where there's that slit. It's like, at the very end, it's a very gay town. It's got a very gay history. It's got a very queer sort of heritage to it. It's where a lot of theater people came in the early 1900s. People came up here from New York City. Hold on, you're telling me there were gay guys in the early 1900s? Well, yeah, closeted, but they were here. And Eugene O'Neill put on his very first play here. And then there's just a crazy collection of weirdos that come here like over the course of – We've been talking about Provincetown a lot because we were told that we should do a show, a How Long Gone show at the Dick Dock. Oh, hell yeah. Really good idea. And then several people were like, we'll help you set that up and then get you out of there before sundown. You know what I mean? So everything stays above board. It's a genius idea. I've seen performances done. The Dick Doc, for those of you out there who don't know what it is, it's underneath this. It's a literal space underneath the dock, on the sand, at the water, where guys go and get it on. And it's so renowned, and it's such a thing. You want to get it on? Yeah, you can look it up on Google Maps. It's there on Google Maps.

Okay. It comes up as Dick Doc or maybe something else? The Dick Doc. That's cool. I'm glad that Google didn't block that or censor it. Right? But you've been there enough times. You're able to get to the Dick Doc without having to type it into your ways or drop a pin, right? I know exactly where it is, yes. But it gets so crazy down there. I don't really go there. I have a boyfriend, so I don't really go there too much. But I've been there before. My friend was here last summer. It ain't a crime to look, Roddy. It ain't a crime to look. Yeah. I mean, I'll go there. I will. I mean, I go. My friend was there last summer and he was like texting me from there. And I was like, just like, how many guys are down there right now? It was like 11 o'clock at night, like on a Thursday. And he's like, all right, I'm going to walk the course of the dick talk and count. And there were over 90 dudes down in there getting their dick sucked. 90 men. Just on a Thursday night. That's actually overwhelming to the point where I feel like that could turn some users off, maybe. It's like going to a movie theater and you can't find a seat, you know? It's part of that. So many options, though. So many options. That's a good point. I guess you can go do your shopping. Yeah, because it reminds me of, like, obviously the proximity to the water. It reminds me of, like, the surf report. You know, I got a little cam set up. you know oh it's too busy out there i'm gonna wait until later till it dies down but maybe with the in the dick sucking community it's kind of like a little more people more the better the more like we're we're way beyond privacy at this point at the dick for sure max it out and no one's being shy you know no i that yeah that that is not something your community is necessarily known for is shyness no it's a it's a free-for-all but it's really pretty here you guys should come here like provincetown is so great Over the summer, it's great. I've always wanted to go, but I guess where do you think I would be the most happy, in Provincetown or Fire Island, based on knowing me for the last five minutes? Provincetown is definitely like you're separated from the rest of the world. Fire Island is very close. You're pretty much still in New York City, and you only get that demographic. It's very close, and you feel like you're in the city pretty much.

Provincetown is very isolated. It's really at the end, end, end of the world, so to speak. You got to want it. Yeah. How long does it take to get there from New York? I mean, that's the catch, Chris. It's like five and a half, six hours drive. Okay. Can we fly? That's Glendale to San Francisco. No biggie. Yeah, yeah. You can fly, but it's like they're tiny little planes, you know, those little six-seaters that are so scary. Well, Roddy, that's how I want to die, so I'm kind of trying to take any opportunity I can to get on something of that size. You can do that. It doesn't come up that often, so I have to take the opportunities when they present themselves. When you die in a plane crash, when they find out it was headed to P-Town, What a heavenly way to die, Chris. I'm not going to beat the allegations if I die on the way to P-Town. Oh, my God. You had a speculation and the rumors. Where was he going? P-Town. He was on his way to P-Town. You've been going there, I assume, for decades. Not so long. I grew up in California, and I moved here to the East Coast. 2010, and I started coming up here then. And then, like, during the pandemic, my boyfriend and I got a place up here, and he started a store up here. So, really, we come up just for the summer times, basically. Yeah. He started a really cute boutique sort of souvenir store here. What is he peddling at the boutique? What kind of wears? He makes shirts and hats and sweatshirts and really tasty, like, clothing stuff. Okay. And he sells it in this really adorable tiny store. It's called the Old Baby. That's really nice. But we usually come up for just like the summer, usually. But we're moving in New York, so we're kind of biding time until the place that we move into in New York is done. So we're up here for the winter, which is kind of a stretch. You're saying is everything closed type? Oh, my God. So fucking tight. It's so boring. You can't imagine. So fucking tight. Yeah, I mean, the famous restaurant Sals in P-Town, they famously leave. And then come to L.A. now the last couple of years. Yeah. Have you been to the one in Los Angeles, Jason? Yeah. I've been a handful of times. Yeah. She's like it. Yeah. Yeah. It's a great vibe. You know, just you walk in. Everyone knows your name. Nobody is straight except me. The martinis are strong. The pasta is flowing. Everyone, you know, cash only. They're cool. You got a call to make a res. It's a good vibe.

I like it a lot. They're cool. I like those people. Siobhan is the boss woman. I'm going to say something that I shouldn't, but I want to say it anyway. It's fascinating. It's like a thing over the summer. People who dine at Sal's in the summertime in Provincetown, they don't pay for their meals if they live here. You mean that's the trade? If you're like a real Provincetown resident, this is your canteen. And for a while, for a while, we were paying and stuff. We were like, what's up? What's up? But I think we kind of crossed the line and we're kind of recognized right now as such as locals. Yeah, it's huge. Wow. I mean, I've never paid there thanks to our friends at Purple PR, but it's for different reasons, I guess. What's that mean? What's Purple PR? It's just a PR agency that we're friends with, but they happen to represent that restaurant. And our dear friend Stevie, who's probably listening to this right now, is always generous with inviting us over for fabulous birthday dinners and things like that over at Sal's. Damn, okay, bragger. I mean, you're bragging too. We're both getting free clamps. Just two different ways to get there, brother. But I feel like mine is kind of earned. Like I earned the status of mine. Well, it's a purple PR. What's the benefit? How do you get that? I'm a micro-influencer, Roddy. So when I go there, I'll talk about it on this beautiful podcast, post a photo on my Instagram. Someone's getting paid. It's just not us or the restaurant. You know what I mean? No, it makes sense. Yeah, I want to know how you, a homeowner, is able to go into a small local business and refuse to pay their money. What's up with that, Roddy? You're right. I'm really honest. It's just on the coattails of my boyfriend and his store. He's a small business owner in the area as well. Yeah. So it feels like. Because this happened because we went together and we got like the treatment. It was so great. And then I went again later by myself. They forgot your ass, didn't they? They didn't know who you were. Nothing. Nothing. Imperial tea? Nothing? Okay.

I like your guys' podcast. I've never heard it before. I started listening to it after we talked to Chris. I listened to a bunch of episodes. It was really fun. Oh, great. I'm sure you had some friends in the mix probably over the years. I did. I started out listening to theirs, but then I really liked the two of you talking. It was really fun. You guys have a good chemistry. Hey, thank you. See, you're a real head. Thank you for saying that. That's important. Do you guys fight a lot or do you get along just famously all the time? We don't fight. We've never gotten a fist fight, actually, which is good for both of us. I didn't mean that, but is there any passive-aggressive behavior or anything like that? Oh, yeah, definitely. Jason's the king of passive-aggressive. You should ask his wife about it. I thought I got it bad, and then he got married. I'm a bomb dropper. That's cool. But I like the conversations. It's really fun to tap into people who are friends and are just chatting. It's really fun to sit on the sidelines of that. I did listen to a bunch of guest shows that were fun. But then I kind of like, yeah, I like your camaraderie. I like the talk between the two of you. Thank you. Thank you. It's a funny, that's usually what our friends tell us or people that we respect tell us that. Yeah, and also people like to listen to a podcast just to kind of turn off their inner dialogue and all the stuff they got to worry about every day. I have more fun listening to two people just bullshit and chat about whatever they're doing. It could be I went to the gas station and whatever, versus interviewing somebody. It's kind of the same thing every time. I think so, too. I don't care much for an agenda, but I do love a cozy place, and you guys are creating that. We're going to steal that. How long ago on a cozy place? It's an agenda-free cozy place. Not an agenda. Dot, dot, dot. A cozy place. You're welcome. That's a freebie. That's a freebie. Thank you for that. For our three sold-out nights at the Dick Doc, that's going on the poster. Those are limited edition silk screens. You guys, that is such a fun idea, though. Doing it at the Dick Doc would be...

monumental okay we're gonna you know what we're gonna make this happen yeah make it happen i have some personal hang-ups that i'll run by you as two straight guys going there is this performance art is it gay baiting it you know could it be taken as appropriation or something wrong way yeah by some people you know obviously i think it'll be most people it's like funny to just watch a couple of guys hang out and interview some people and you know we have an open mind it's all good but i've experienced some people who are a little bit turned off by i can see that i could go there but also you know if you like embrace it and you have like a couple gay guests and you're in the mix that's fine of course yeah also jason if they don't like it they can go fuck themselves i mean if we're i i don't i don't think it's a i understand your i understand where you're coming from but at a certain point it's like we gotta have we're having fun you know we gotta have i like your i like your attitude You're the first person to ever say that, so thank you. He has a notoriously awful attitude, so yeah, I just kind of like that. So where are you moving in New York? Just a new apartment, same neighborhood, or are we switching the game up? A new apartment, no. We were in the West Village for a long time. I've been there for almost [redacted address]. You know where the Jane Street Hotel is, the Jane Hotel? Of course, of course. But Grady Cross Street from there I lived for a long time. And there's this big parking lot next to our building that's been sort of this big, like, empty space between where I lived and the West Side Highway. And it's been dreamy for, like, you know, 10 years. And they started building a high-rise in that space. And I have the top floor of my building, so I have the rooftop, which is nice. It's not just the view that's getting taken away from me by this high-rise, but it's the aggression of the build is insane. The aggression of the build, that's what I'm trying to achieve in the gym, so I get it. But I know this happened to me on Broom Street, too. It's fucking crazy. It's so loud and noisy and the dust and just so many things. I never thought I would move from that apartment, but I just kind of like...

i don't know once we made the decision like you know what we could move from here it just kind of all fell into place so we're moving to we're moving to gray street bond street between lafayette and bowery which is amazing and it's gonna be really i like this i'm glad that you live in i'm really glad you didn't say some fucking far-flung part of brooklyn i i'm happy yeah who's your boyfriend bond street okay no way man that's all me Joey is my boyfriend, but he did. He had his eye on Bond Street for a long time. We kind of always look at real estate stuff. And just this crazy old weird loft went on the market where this woman lived, a painter, and she passed away like three years ago, and her kids on this space, and they were looking to get rid of it. And it's a big empty space that we kind of have to build up, but it's really beautiful. It's on that street. That street is so nice. This is the New York dream. I don't know what you mean. I know. Well, I just remembered. Yeah. Daddy got Apple stock early, right? Daddy did. Did you read the book? I did not read the entire thing, but I did pull. I did a large skimming, and I have a lot of the large moving pieces. It's funny that that's one of the pieces that you would pull, the Apple stock. Say no if it's too much, but are you able to say what year and how much Apple stock you bought? Well, I'll tell you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I will. The guys, to your listeners, are talking about, in my book, I wrote a book, and the book is very revealing. There's a lot of stuff in the book that is insane. It's a memoir-style book. It's a memoir-style book. But it's more than a memoir-style book. There's so much that I reveal. You bust it wide open. It really is crazy. I talk about having sex with older men in the bushes when I was 12 years old, just for starters. We're going to get into all that. Yeah. We can get into all that. But one of the things. I've got my bullet points. Don't worry. Jason is talking about. So I was in the band Faith No More. And we had toured for a long, long, long, long, long, long time. And we just toured in the van and toured in the van and toured in the van. And we didn't make any money for a really long time. That's just the way that it went. And at one point, we started to get a tiny bit of notoriety. And one Christmas, we each got a check. Like we had finished our tour and we were going back on tour like soon after. But we each got a check, each of us in the band.

for $12,000, which this was like 19, I don't know, like maybe 91 or something. I'm not good with years. But it was really a lot of money at the time, $12,000. And I had this insane boyfriend at the time who was, it's kind of a crazy backstory, but like we all were just like crazy scrappy kids in San Francisco with dreadlocks, bicycle messengers, you know, pot smokers. We were just... hooligans basically and we were very provocative kids and one of the things that we did in that era just to fuck with people was uh we would watch the stock market just because it was the most outlandish crazy behavior of kids in that sort of realm doing that like you didn't even imagine like what are these kids what and we would like talk about stocks yeah you okay so you were talking about stocks while like squatting so it felt like counterintuitive so so there's people walking around with like crass patches and just like full san francisco crust exactly like lighting shit on fire crazy street art taxidermy murder all this stuff and you're like their vital research laboratory dot dot dot so much shit and we would like just to provoke and fuck with people we would talk about yeah did you hear like uh Yeah, Microsoft is really doing pretty good this quarter. Like, just to talk with people. But anyway, that's where we were as kids, just pro-va-course. And so when I got that $12,000, the boyfriend that I had at the time was like, just buy Apple stock with it. Like, you're not going to do anything with the money anyway. We were living together, me and the boyfriend, and we were going on tour soon. And we kind of had enough money to take care of ourselves when we went on tour. So I just bought Apple stock at that point, $12,000 worth. You put it all. You put it all. Yeah. Yeah. I put it all on Apple stock. And that was like 1990. So I don't know. I would dot, dot, dot, let the listeners get out the calculators and figure it out. Okay. The December 31st, 1991 year end closing price of Apple stock was 40 cents per share. Also, Jason, it's.

split a bunch of times, so I'm not even really sure how accurate. Right now it's at $285, and then I know it's split many times. Of all the things you could have done with that money at that age, I'm shocked that this joke worked out as well as it did. I'm really happy for you. Isn't it insane? It's so wild. I don't feel bad bragging about it because it's such an outlandish, crazy story. It's like winning the lottery. How did that even... I mean, a lot of my things in my life have happened in that same way. But that particular instance was so insane. And when I was writing my book, you know, a lot of people like my boyfriend was like, are you sure you want to put that in the book? And even the publishers were like, are you sure you want to reveal that? I was like, yes, I do. I don't think that's a crazy thing. Yeah, it's a fun story. I don't know. It's not like it's. Also, I just checked. Apple stock has split a total of five times. So, you know, I would say you could do the math because I can't on how all that works. But it kind of reminds me of the artist David Cho and his Facebook stock. Do you know that story? No. He traded his bad art for stock. They hired him to paint a mural in the Facebook offices like very early days. And they said, you know, we'll give you, you know, five grand or we can pay you in stock. And he just took stock randomly. And I think he became maybe like a hundred millionaire from that. It happens so rarely, you know, and it is, it's like winning the lottery. That's why I kind of felt like fine about talking about it. But it's one of those things. It really just changed my life. I love that. I love that. Are you still active in investing and things like that? I don't really invest, honestly, Jason. I just have that stock. I have that Apple stock still. I don't invest. I just spend. And I bought an apartment in New York at one point and just stuff like that. But I don't really do stock stuff. And honestly, I really wasn't so into stock back at the time. I was posing a little bit when I was talking stock. No, this is the best.

best case scenario to make that much bread and be like you know what i don't need to do this again like i don't need to play the market i figured it out once that's the best i'm gonna do for a while i was like i remember i was like oh i'm gonna get pepsi stock because know why pepsi owns taco bell and i love taco bell but that didn't really pan out they do they do say only buy stock and things that you support that you love you know yeah yeah yeah yeah that's why i lost i lost my house on american apparel but here we are you know oh you did no No, I'm joking. I'm joking. No, it's funny because my wife's dad has like a little bit of investing rule of thumb. Like if you invest in a company with America in the name, the chances of it ever completely shutting down, going bankrupt are low because the government will bail out American Airlines or any of these. larger companies, but then American Apparel is the exception to the rule. That's interesting. Dove couldn't get that bailout. Dove could get it from Trump, but he couldn't have gotten it back when he needed it. Is that dude involved in the new American Apparel or no? Oh, yeah. Do we talk about this? We went into the store because they reopened the store on Broadway and it's in the old Top Shop. It's fucking huge. It's unbelievable. If you go in there, you're just sort of like, I can't. It's exactly the same. But the scale is so large and the furnishings are so cheap that it doesn't feel as sexy as it did, obviously, the first time around. But the product is good. The actual product is good. The product was always good. We always liked that, didn't we? Yeah, everybody. oh yeah i don't know any person that's like from our general age group and world that didn't wear american apparel that didn't from a from a band perspective too i remember like for a while there we were all like oh yeah we only use american apparel for our merch stuff yeah it's just the right thing to do it's the right thing to do yeah it's support support men it's all like it at the time I like their briefs, too. They were super sexy. I don't know if you guys ever went there, but I like their briefs. Yeah, I was just going to ask you, what colors were we using for our briefs, Robbie? So many. There were so many. There was like a lavender that was really fetching.

There was a light brown that was so pretty. What are we wearing now, then? Are we wearing Calvin Klein? Are we traditional? No, I'm like a boxer guy. I will either go Ralph Lauren boxer or Sunspell boxer. How about you guys? Sunspell is a really good boxer. My wife works at Calvin Klein, so I'm obligated to wear Calvin Klein. Oh, nice. I wear Arcteryx underwear. Oh, I don't know that brand. I mean, I know what they are, but I've never seen their underwear. Is it a boxer brief? Boxer brief, yeah. I would say they're not known for the boxer brief, but it's a sleeper hit. I just happen to enjoy them. They just fit me perfectly. They're kind of expensive, right? Yeah, they're like $30, $40 a pair. I guess that's kind of what everything costs now. Tim wears the Turnbull and Aster. It's on the higher end. Charvet, Turnbull, and Aster. Those cotton ones for $150. Also, Roddy, Skims. Don't sleep on Skims. Kim Kardashian's underwear company. They make a lot of great low-profile boxer briefs. No, they do. I didn't know that. It's kind of new. They're one of our sponsors. The good people at Skims. They'll come for anybody. They'll come for anyone, men, women, children, non-binary. We'll try to get a three-pack over to the house, okay, Roddy? I would love it, but time out. Is Skims really one of your sponsors? That's right. Yeah. That is amazing. Good work, guys. That's so cool. Hey, thank you. Thank you. I don't even know what to say to that. You know, we've accomplished so many of our goals. And when you check Skims off. Yeah. I think it's because Skims accomplished all of their sales goals in the women's department. So they said, you know, we're leaving this money on the table. So, you know, male-centric podcasts are a good way to sell that. Well, they also gave millions of dollars to the NBA, which is probably a... Post Malone has a pair of Realtree camo Skim underwear as well, I think. I could see you in some Realtree. I might go there. You might go there. I might go there. I don't know. I'm not super Kardashian at this specific moment, but I would try it. Are you saying you've gone through phases where you love them and now you're at a low point? Well, season four was season four. Yeah. I mean, where she seems to be right now, Kim specifically, is a little bit odd for me. The Trumpy connection is a little bit weird.

I do like the show, though. The show is amazing. We started watching the show. Oh, my God. All of our friends, the whole gay, my gay community, it is the worst. Yeah, it's awesome. You cannot believe how bad. It is so good. Right? All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Quince. Jason, the temps are warming up. It's getting hot out there. Summer always changes how I get dressed. I need pieces that feel lighter, more breathable, and they're just easy but still put together. I don't want to look like a slob. That's why I keep coming back to Quince. They focus on high-quality essentials that feel and look amazing. Breathable linen and soft organic cottons. Well-made basics but without the luxury markups. That rare balance where everything feels elevated. but still effortless. Yeah, Chris, linen season is here. I wore a linen blazer to dinner a few nights ago in the warm California sun. But, you know, you got that Italy trip coming up this summer and quality European linen pants and shirts. Upgrade that look starting at just $34. You know, if you get a nice linen suit, a little t-shirt underneath it, some chill shoes, you're looking good, but you're staying cool. The inside of your special areas are nice and dry as you turn up with your besties. So elevate that summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash how long for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, even on a nice holiday now available in Canada. That is Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash how long. That'll get you free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince punto com slash how long. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down.

The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? Especially when it's not from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen. Oh, sorry. I don't mean meet the Kardashians. I mean the Ryan Murphy show. Oh, both of them are bad. The Ryan Murphy show is unbelievable. Unbelievable levels of bad, like to the point where. See, not for me. I love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. She just came out and said that, you know, she's got having brain problems. She's like her, you know, the frontal lobe is not firing the way it should. I don't know if you saw this. So people think it's a setup for some sort of new product they're going to release, like a vitamin. I think she's trying to get a little... bar exam you know a little side she's failed the bar exam a couple times i thought she passed i thought she passed the bar exam unfortunately no she's not licensed if she fails a third time i think that's three strikes or at least she has to wait another like a long amount of time yeah i think you have to wait a little bit a number of years before you can do so maybe she's like getting the brain scans and saying like you know i'm gonna Come to the bar with a note from my doctor. Next time I have an off podcast, I'm going to come back and have a note from my doctor where I had an MRI and be like, look, there's a hole in the front of my brain. Give me half a bar. I could do so much with just half a bar. That's funny, though. I agree. Maybe she's on to something. Maybe she's going to do something with vitamins. Well, I mean, she did that photo. She famously did the photo shoot with Elon's robot.

and was clearly in the bag. She's done a lot of robot stuff. Yeah, I feel like there's going to be something in the robot, vitamin, brainwave. Elon does the Neuralink. What if Kim Kardashian is the first person to have a hole drilled in her skull and then having Elon's microchip inserted? It's not out of the question. I can pass the bar. Some sort of mushroom something maybe might be in the works. Reishi and Lion's Mane are in play. Absolutely. There's definitely some Lion's Mane in play. Okay, I want to go back a little bit to the early L.A. days. I know you were born in L.A. and then moved when you were a teenager to San Francisco. A little pull quote that I pulled, you mentioned Los Angeles is a horrible place for a child. And do you still feel that way? Has it gotten worse? It was kind of a cheeky way of writing about Los Angeles. But like when I moved out of Los Angeles when I was like 17, I was so over it. Like growing up in that environment with like what I was saying in the book was like day after day after day of sun and, you know, the mundanity of that. And also coupled sort of with the entertainment industry and just sort of this allure of what. Los Angeles is to the rest of the world in terms of like entertainment. And like back when I was a kid, it was like, man, I'm pretty and blonde. It was just like, couldn't be further away from where I wanted to go with my life as a young 17 year old. And I was trying to sort of embody that sort of like mind ethic when I was writing about Los Angeles. I love Los Angeles and I go there still, but wow, Los Angeles is super dark right now. you know i spent some time there just recently just a couple weeks ago i was there i did my book thing there and it's sort of like i feel like it's sort of like creeping a little bit out of the darkness but like just so much has happened the fires you know and i was there specifically when the ice thing was kicking off you know and that started and it was just like wow i mean we've experienced so many decades of los angeles just being this place of glory you know and especially you know people in new york they love to talk about how like

People have moved to Los Angeles and just like the benefits of that. Oh, it's so great. There's so much space. And it's just so, the classical, it's just so easy. It's just so easy. And the produce. And suddenly we're in this era right now where it's not. It's really, really dark. Like the homeless situation is just so intense. And the ice thing is so fucked up. What I'm getting to say, I think it's just like Los Angeles right now deserves our compassion. That's where I'm coming from. Thank you. And I do love it. My best friends are there, and I still love it there. But doesn't every city go through this, you know, kind of the ups and downs? I don't know. Like, Los Angeles had ups higher than any other ups. Like, people always regarded it as just, like, this mecca, you know? So it had that. And the downs, where we are right now, is really, really low, you've got to admit, Chris. But you – oh, no, I agree with you. I just – you lived in – like, Jason always – we always talked about this a lot. Jason really romanticized. synthesized san francisco growing up and you live there are arguably during the heyday of when it was the coolest place in the world and it now it had a terrible phase and now people are considering it on the upswing again and it's like sort of you know thanks to the ai money etc etc it's coming i just feel like this is the natural progression of cities but what you're saying is la had a longer run as sort of pleasantville yeah like you're like every every city has A lot of problems with homelessness as well as ICE, you know, Austin, Chicago, Miami, blah, blah, blah. But L.A. as well. But they were so highly esteemed and regarded, whereas Austin, maybe less so, you know. I think so. It was a mightier tumble. I have a family perspective in Los Angeles, too. When I go there, I will stay with my sister. You know, she has kids and all the kids are like in their 20s or like kind of like. later teenage years you know and they're super like i love them all but they're very involved in the politics of los angeles right now you know like one of them works for the union that represents day workers you know they're very much like on the front line of sort of like fighting trump and fighting the this so your sister so your sister's rich is what you're saying well no i mean they get by that's another problem in itself like her husband is like works for the entertainment industry and they're having problems because you know that too like

All of that, they've lost their source of income. But anyway, my point was the kids, when I go there and I stay there, I'm surrounded by those kids and their energy, of teenage energy, and it's so intense. The way that they're dealing with Los Angeles in its darkness is really just like, wow! So much drama. It's really affecting them. And it affects me. And your ability to relax in Los Angeles? Kind of, yeah. We need a little more anarchism with our young people, I think. Yeah, Jason, they're committing anarchy. They're paying $22 for a smoothie. That's anarchism in its own way. Wearing your Chromeheart sweatpants while protesting is its own way. Okay, starting off early, being born until 17, you said, in Los Angeles. I've been back many, many times over the years, I'm sure. Back in the 80s, in the heyday, what were the best cruising spots in Los Angeles, if you remember them? I would take my bike and ride up to Griffith Park. Do you know where Trails is? Have you ever been there? Of course. Oh, yeah. Known for a veggie sandwich? Yeah. Right across from Trails, there's a tiny little pond, and there's a whole scene in my book that I talk about. When we went up there as kids, we would ride our bike up there and just go to the hills and smoke pot. And we were super young. We were probably like, I don't know, 13, 14. And we got up there and we were around that little pond right across some trails. And for some reason, there was a body in the pond, which is insane. We discovered this body that was in the pond. Like Law and Order style? Kind of, yeah. Was the body jacking off or was it floating? It was floating. It isn't really connected to the cruising, but in those initial days when I would go up there on my bike. I would see men like up in the bushes. And as a young person, I was like, oh, I couldn't get on my bike fast enough and go back quick enough to sort it out. So up there, right around there, like fire up into the hills, like right.

Up from where Trails is, there was a lot, a lot, a lot of cruising up there. And then kind of around where the tennis courts are, you know, in Griffith Park, and the other where the Five is, you know, like at Los Feliz Boulevard. Yeah, this is unfortunately the two places that I recognize the most from my time in Griffith Park. So I don't know what that says about me. Somehow interesting how those things line up. I don't know. That's where Jason taught me to hike. Where to hike is at that. Good diversion. Flip it on to me. That's smart. It's just like your fascination with P-Town. How was your Sherpa? No, it's just funny that of all the places to name, I have spent no time in that park except at those tennis courts and parking the car across some trails to go on a hike. Those are the only two places. We do have an aesthetic eye, don't we? That's true. As well as some other people. That's true. Those places, that really doesn't exist so much anymore. Like you were saying, the 80s, and really much specifically, those places were very cruisy. You know where else was cruisy, which was crazy, at nighttime, down on Melrose, in between, I want to say, Fairfax and... Martell, sort of, on Melrose Boulevard. Like, there was this kind of, I guess it was an adult bookstore. It was called Drake's. It was on the south side of Melrose. And for some reason, there was just a hub around that. And guys would just get in their cars and just drive around the block and cruise each other. That was a really heavy scene back in the 80s. So for some reason, the sex shop got people horny, is what you're saying. In a shocking revelation. Okay, so just anywhere near there, you just drive your car around. Because I remember when I first came to L.A., you would see all these signs up in some neighborhoods. you know silver lake and things like that and there would be signs that said no cruising and i would and when i first moved there i assumed that it was like a anti-mexican like low rider type of initiative like don't have all the gangsters rolling their cars cruising down the boulevard i had no idea that it was like there was so much cruising happening that they had to put up signs like stop chugging here guys

Now, go on and get. I kind of thought that, too. It could be both. I thought it was like, yeah, older car choosing. It could be both. But right around there where the signs were up, Jason, was a bar called Cuffs. And Cuffs was sort of like right where. That's good. It really walks that line. I know, really good. Gay bar names are so good. But just across from, I think it's across now from where, like, maybe there's a spin studio right across the street. You know where that is? I'm like. uh hyperion yeah yeah yeah but it was right across the street from there and it was a dingy little club and it was super like charged like so cruisy so much fun like there was a man in there who was like he was like a constant he was always there and he just sit on a stool and he had a big wooden paddle and guys would come by and they knew they knew they knew what his deal was and they come and they just like lay over his lap, and he'd go at him with a wooden paddle. Wow. That was just one of the many scenarios that was going on in class. I'll give you a little Werther's original afterwards. I mean, it stayed open late. It stayed open until like, I don't know, like four in the morning. It turned into an after-doward thing, and they'd shut the door, and then guys would get really... Crazy. When I used to go to bars, there'd be a guy sitting there all the time, but he was just a Coke dealer. There was no paddle involved. I would have taken a couple spankings and given me a discount. How bad do you want the bag, brother? Yeah, let me get a gram for 30 if you can give me a couple smacks. Isn't that funny, though, the guy with the paddle? Like, what the hell? It reminds me of the... Do you remember the guy that would roll himself up in a carpet and then go to bars because he got off on people walking on him? I think it might still sort of happen. It's not that old. Have you seen this, Roddy? I've never heard of such a thing. Is it a gay thing or a straight thing? I think it transcends. I've never seen the guy. It literally just looks like a rolled up carpet or Persian rug just at a bar. That sounds kind of straight.

It does feel kind of straight. I think he likes it more when women walk on him than men. You know what I mean? Right, right. It feels a little lazy and unimaginative, but hell, he's getting this. But imagine how hard it is you have to go to a club or a bar and be like, hey, is it okay if I bring in this 12-foot Persian rug, roll myself up like a taquito, create a massive fire hazard? And a cause of injury for multiple people. And I just want people to walk on me. I'll give you no money. That's wild. I'm not going to buy any drinks. I like it. I do not like it. Hopefully he's hard in there the whole time. I wanted to see if enough time has passed. You're a wise man. Are you able to defend white dreads at this point in your life? Not really. It was a real stretch back then. But when I was a kid, I'd never seen it before. It was uncharted territory. Yeah. Yeah. I can't even, I don't even know where we went. Like us as kids, Jason is talking about viewers, listeners, like when Faith and More started, we all like had dreadlocks for some reason. And we were white kids with dreadlocks. And to make it even more complicated, which is like difficult for me, but like we were really into like the last poets at the time, the sort of black revolutionary sort of word speak group that were very political. And so there was a deep kind of like embarrassingly like weird appropriation of that kind of culture that I don't feel great about. But that's what it was. It was a different world and that's where we were. But in that context, yeah, straight like white kid dreads are a little triggering for me. I think the original iteration that you're speaking of, you know, early 90s, it had a little like cyberpunk. hacker feel to it there and a little bit of like a techno kind of industrial feel to it as well i know like nine inch nails and ministry and bands like that had one or two dreadlocked members in it typically right for sure it turned into that for sure and even before that i think it was like you brought up crafts before i think crafts had sort of sense of that too like in real like sort of like scroungy like kind of like um squat

It was very popular. White people can have dreads, but they have to earn it in a crass kind of way. It can't be in a Ross Trent kind of way. Andy Sandberg or a guy going to a Phish concert who goes to Yale with the white dreads. That one doesn't click. But if the hair is dreading because you live on a train, I think we can excuse it, right? I think so. But anyway, it's triggering for me still. Sure. Sure, sure, sure. Naturally so. So after you moved to San Francisco, 80s, 90s, I've always thought of, you know, like Chris was saying earlier, when I was in high school, late 90s era, I heard all these rumors that it was like the best place to go paint graffiti. And I heard that like on Sundays, the police wouldn't really enforce graffiti and you can just kind of go and paint in the daytime and, you know, sort of do non... violent crimes and the city would just kind of be okay with it how how lawless was was the bay area when you first got there i don't know what you're speaking of the pink graffiti that's fascinating to me though but like when we got there it was yeah it felt like that it felt definitely lawless and a big element of it was the bicycle messengers and i was a bicycle messenger for a long time and that was just such uh an insane realm of kids like there was a lot of dreadlocks in that crowd and just mohawks and attitude and uh it was just like crazy pirates out on the street on our bicycles and we would just like fuck with everybody there was this one area where we would sort of like camp and smoke pods smoke cigarettes and fuck with the businessmen it's called the wall It was on Samsung down at Market, and it was like this long stretch, and all the bicycle motors, the messengers, we would meet there and just like, fuck with people. It's still like, no, it's still there, and it's still where bike messengers go. Is that true? I've walked by that a million times. I mean, it may be not now now, but I would say at least five years ago, for sure, yeah. Because I had a roommate who was a bike messenger in Atlanta when I was growing up, and I was always fascinated with it because it seemed like he made a lot of money. Because, and correct me if I'm wrong, is it a per delivery?

Is that how you make money? Like every, every package you drop off your page. So the faster you are, the more money you make. Yeah, for sure. It was commissioned. Yeah. Um, but so much fun too. Like we have walkie talkies, you know, we're screaming in the streets that for sure had a real lawlessness to it. But that's surprising me, uh, to me, Chris, there's still, do you think there's, are there still, uh, bicycle messengers? I'm sure. Definitely less, but they exist. Yeah, but I feel like in San Francisco, it's still faster at this point than a car. You know what I mean? With traffic and shit, it's still faster. Same as I see it in New York as well, a decent amount. Simply for the reason that a person who's really good on a bicycle can get around that city faster than somebody in a car. Yeah. Straight up. Depending on how much of a pirate you are and how willing you are to violate traffic laws and things like that. When's the last time you got on a bike? I still ride a bike every day. But also, I'm thinking there's probably things that have to be delivered, like physical things, like maybe art things that can't be sent digitally. Large blueprints, I see a decent amount. During your era, wasn't it legal documents that would be going from buildings? buildings i mean yeah that's you can't put that in an uber really you know what i mean like that i don't know what the fastest way is that's how i lost my job like i was moving something i don't even know what the company bechdel was but i was moving i was delivering something to bechdel do you know what that company is no no i don't know back then they were really evil like conglomerate i don't even know what they were but i was delivering some court case I remember, and I had them in my pouch, in my bag, and you weren't ever supposed to leave your stuff in the bag on your bike for this very reason. And I took my bike home, and I remember I went upstairs, and I was watching TV, smoking pot, and I just left the stuff in the bag outside in front of my house, and it got stolen. And it wasn't so much like the bike. It wasn't my bike that mattered, but it was the court case negatives that I had lost. Because the negatives are, at that point, that's a one-of-one situation. There's maybe not a copy of those lying around. And also, I just Googled Bechtel Corporation, an American engineering procurement, construction, project management company, one of the most closely guarded, secretive, multinational companies in the world.

I fucked them up, didn't I? So, I mean, you lose some negatives, you might not, yeah, you might wake up in a pond, you lose those nags. Yeah, so I lost my job as a result of that one, and then I never went back. You moved on. What kind of, were you a fixed gear daddy? No, we had, I don't think there were fixies back then. That hadn't happened yet. I mean, there were, but they were really old school. Yeah, we used gears for sure. Well, there's a lot of hills up there. A lot of hills up there. And the hills. I still don't know how those fixies work, too. How does, like, do you ride one of those, Jason? When I was a teen graffiti enthusiast, well into my 20s, I was a fixed gear rider every day, my main means of transportation. I still ride, but it's a single speed now. So I've never understood this about fixies. Can you clear this up for me, please? Like, if you want to stop, there's no brake. You start pedaling backwards. You put your foot on the ground or you put your foot in the tire. and try to go down from there but jason is it like the bikes that we had as children where like we had one gear bikes and we would like reverse the pedals and that would put on the brakes is it like that or is it different it's different that's that's a coaster brake where it pedal backwards it just turns into a literal brake system this is you pedal the the cranks backwards and then the wheel starts rolling backwards. You pedal forwards, it starts rolling. So when you're going fast on a hill and you start pedaling backwards, it doesn't really work. You have to jump up. and skid or you know do some other stuff so you're you're you're not able to it's for it's for hot dogging it's for hot dog you're not able to slow down quickly the only reason to do this is to hot dog it's not practical in any way it's so it's like soul surfing you feel everything in the road you you become really truly one with the machine it is a amazing feeling actually but people swear by it it seems so psychotically dangerous though right

Yeah, but people ride motorcycles every day. One of the things I can't wrap my head around, the danger level. I'm just like, why on earth would you do that? Why would you do that? I do that for years and years on a motorcycle. I see motorcycles these days and I think the same thing. Why would you even go there? I would rather do drugs. I would rather get as close as I can. If I'm going to die, I want to die in a plane crash or from drugs. I know. Talk about risks. Motorcycling is just like, that's a death wish. Yeah, I really have never understood it. Even with a helmet. Call me a pussy, bud. Yeah, I think now that the helmet laws are in effect for bicycles, they had to remove the brakes or else you would feel it was one thing or another. Before helmets were for pussies and now brakes are for pussies. It's just something to think about there, my friend. I do want to talk about heroin a little bit. Sure, I love talking about heroin. Me and you both, King. in your time it was it was only baseline risky right because it was like this is pre like fentanyl this is pre so you had to like it was like a real man's od is what i'm trying to say you had to just do too much if you if you were going to have a problem yeah i don't think there was ever a case of like a bad batch or something yeah yeah and definitely there was no fentanyl like that was never an issue it didn't feel safe it felt dangerous yeah and felt risky and it felt like you were definitely like um fucking with you know something really serious i mean just the word heroin yeah it's so laden with just like sends a chill down your spine it really it's still it's still it's kind of like that too i still think it's pretty forbidden And also, what kind of crazy person puts a needle in their arm? That's a crazy place to go. Well, that's what I was going to ask you. Did someone do it for you the first time, or did you do it yourself? Someone did it for me the first time. I'm not going to name names, but she was famous. Does Courtney have a steady hand with the needle? It wasn't Courtney. She comes up in the book a lot, listeners. That's why I bring up Courtney. But it was not Courtney, but it was another famous person, a famous woman. But, yeah, you've got to be.

top that but what a crazy thing like i remember like when i stopped doing drugs at one point i was like i'm not even sure i'm an addict because like i don't know like anyone could get addicted to heroin if you did it over and over you just get addicted like it doesn't take an addictive personality for that to happen and my friend was like yeah but it kind of seems like you're the type of person to get high you're going to put a needle in your arm that's like sure oh yeah that's kind of weird that's a little bit extreme Have you been sober for a long time, or are you not sober? Yeah, I mean, I'm not strictly sober. I was sober strictly, like going to meetings and stuff for like 10 years. And then I kind of, I just don't care so much anymore. I don't do anything. I don't drink. I don't ever do drugs. But I'm just, I don't care a whole bunch about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What do you think happened? Were you just tired of it? I don't know what happened. It wasn't like the best of behavior. I remember I was on tour of Faith No More, like later, later, later. And it had been a while, like almost, maybe it was like eight years sober. I was at this festival and it was in Denmark and there was this Ferris wheel. This is really weird. There was a Ferris wheel and it was like the motif and the theme of the Ferris wheel, if you were to look at it as a person at the festival, was mushrooms. And I was like, what is that? And I went over and I got on the Ferris wheel and they're like, here. And they gave me a cup of tea. that they made from mushrooms it was mushroom tea like psychedelic tea and you could ride the ferris wheel and get high from the mushroom tea and at that point i've been sober for a long time and i was just feeling kind of frisky and i was like all right and i just drank the mushroom tea and then from that point i smoked pot a couple times but honestly it never

I never went back to a problematic place. Like my drug of choice was opioids and heroin. I never went back there and I never, I never, I never felt the need to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's good. Are you, are you guys sober? Either one of you, Chris, you're sober. I am. Yeah, I am. That's why I'm always fascinated because I do feel like I hear these stories, you know, people just have such different stories as time goes on. I mean, it's almost. They're so fun. You will get like my book. You'll like the read. If you like, like, I love stories like that. It's so much fun. No, me too. if the person's made it out the other side yeah do you guys know that have you ever heard that um podcast dopey do you know that podcast no it's all well oh it's really fun all about people talking about their like journey yeah okay Yeah, but it's comedians also. So it's done in a really disrespectful kind of like fun way. It's really fun. I just made friends with those people recently, and they're so fun. I really like them. I like disrespectful. It's big. I also wanted to ask you if you are a – have you had sex with a woman or are you a gold star? I've had sex with a woman. You haven't read the book. No, I haven't read the book. I didn't have time to read the book either. Courtney Love, one of them. Yeah, Courtney was one of them. We were lovers. I knew you dated, but I had a relationship. I didn't know if you ever took it. You never know. Yeah, we went there. You know, it's funny. As a kid, as a young person, it feels like, I mean, as you're sort of growing up, really, as young people, as young, like, crazy, amped-up, horny boys, we'll just have sex any which way we can. You know what I mean? Take what you can get. Yeah. Yeah, it holds a hole. Oh, my God. Not like that, but kind of like that. That's disgusting. You're gross. Not like that, but maybe a little bit like that. Well, it was. Like, you know what I mean? As a kid, like, you'll fuck anything. Of course. But I don't want to say. But it crassly. I'm sorry, but that's what it was. I don't want to say Courtney Love is anything. I mean, I would say she's one of our most talented, you know. She's a step above a cantaloupe in a microwave. We'll say that. Yeah, yeah. You sound like you're in jail.

I always get in trouble. I get in trouble, Roddy. A cantaloupe in a microwave. That's a thing. That's jail shit. Yeah, you got to make it. You don't know about that one, Roddy? Come on. Yeah, you're lying. I mean, of course, right now the kabocha squash is more in season, but you can do a, you know, whatever. You can make it work. I have a PDF I could send. I get in trouble a lot, Roddy, on this podcast because I say I prefer whole to nirvana. All right. And I will stand by that. Are you making Roddy choose between the two? I'm not making him choose between the two. I just feel like it's a subject that we could discuss since it was, you know, a part of his book. That's all. I would never make him choose. My head was still, like, dealing with the cantaloupe. And when you said hole versus Nirvana, I was, like, taking it literally. I was, like, trying to wrap my head around hole. Okay. Nirvana or some hole. You're like me? Nirvana or some hole. I'd fuck a cantaloupe before I have to listen in utero again, I guess. You know, I'm Loki kind of like looking in the kitchen over there, seeing what fruit's available. Oh, gross. See here. Boyfriends at work till five. I love Holdo. Holdo was so impassioned. That was like such a fun band. Did you get into like the very first whole record, Chris? Do you like that one? Not Lift Through This, but I don't remember what it's called. I like it all. I think that... malibu is probably my all-time favorite uh but i think that she just pretty on the inside is that the album pretty on the inside i hadn't seen i hadn't seen that kind of that kind of power before yeah kind of if that makes sense and i i also have gone on to be like a i love female singers that's sort of my bag and i do too that's my bag and i realize in a lot of ways she's the archetype for that as far as especially defining that time period clear way such a force she was so strong he still is so strong like what a voice like not the voice voice voice but such a person in that realm that changed everything i don't think we have but we're not people don't have personalities like that anymore they're not really allowed to yeah i don't know anyone like that yeah hope do you think uh in our lifetime we will the world will sort of forgive courtney and and we will begin to respect and and honor her

the way that she deserves? I don't know. I don't really see her under sort of a thumb like that. Do people, you feel like people don't really respect her now? I don't really know that. I mean, like kind of post Kurt's death, there was always some bad energy there. A lot of people thought that she was responsible for pushing him to that level. And I know that she's had some ups and downs with. with drugs and some some issues with other people and she can be you know yeah it's funny like when i started i remember like talking about stuff if i talk about anything online and i mentioned courtney or anything like the the vitriol that kind of comes my way like i see that and i see those crazy theories but honestly to me it's more like it's like crazy talk it's like conspiracy theorists like more than anything it's like crazy people it's like what are you even like saying like really you think that Courtney killed her husband. Are you serious? Yeah, I used to think that, but I don't think that anymore. Elliot Smith, on the other hand, you know. Elliot Smith, I don't believe it for one second, Jason. I'm with you. She did it. No one stabs themselves. That's too far. That is a really weird death, Elliot Smith. It's too weird. That's really strange. I got too many questions. I got too many questions. But when you make music like that that connects with people, you know, who knows? I think that's the problem. It brings certain things out in people. Yeah. It does. It really does. It's a testament to how much the music connects with people, because otherwise they wouldn't act like that. Chris, did you read the Mark Lanigan autobiography? No, I didn't, actually. I've heard a lot of good stuff about that. God, that's an amazing one. That's a crazy ride. Read that one. After mine, of course, but read it. It's so good. It's so intense. Okay, I'll take you up on that. I've only heard good things about that. And it's fairly, I mean, I know he died. Mark Lanigan. front man of screaming trees but it was that didn't come out that long ago right maybe six years ago he didn't pass that long ago yeah he died like four years yeah he died in 2022 yeah yeah okay that's i was trying to okay yeah i will i'll pick it up i'll hit amazon.com is jason always the one who looks up stuff on his computer and chris you just kind of sit back and let him do that yeah yeah yeah

You know what's funny? It's like when I listened to you guys talk, I could tell that. I was like, oh, he's like on the computer. And then Chris feels just kind of lazy, just like sitting back and just like letting it roll. If I don't know it before we start, then I'm not going to know it while we're doing it. That's kind of where I'm at. But that's why I think that's part of your combination. Like, Jason, you're kind of on it. Yeah. Fire and ice, yin and the yang. I'm a researcher, you know? Fire and ice. I like that. You're like a pack of dentine, fire and ice. But also, since I talk in the pod and then I edit the pod and all that stuff, I put myself in the head of somebody. If I was listening to this, like that's how I edit it. If I was listening to this and I said, this sucks, I just cut it. But if I'm listening to this and I'm like, oh, these guys just said Mark Lanigan, I don't know who the fuck that is. I will look it up. and say, that's the singer of Screaming Trees. And then they'll say, who the fuck is the Screaming Trees? Well, good on you. You're very efficient. Yeah, good. Good follow through. But also, it's a contentious thing in my mind because in our generation and even more so yours, you would read something or listen to a band or whatever and hear a word or a name and you're like, I don't know what that is. And you would ask friends, go to a record store, go to a library, do the research. and figure out who that person was and then there's like a rewarding feeling in that versus you know having chat gpt just shoot you out an answer instantly or have me tell you the answer on the podcast so sometimes i like the idea of making people work for it a little bit nobody wants to work for anything um roddy thank you that's how we sell underwear yeah roddy thanks for joining us on how long gone the book the royal we is everywhere you get books And go stream Faith No More if you still make money off that. I hope you do. I mean, kind of. It's something from a long time ago for me. But, yeah, give it a go. Are you guys going to send me some skims? You know what? Yes, I'll figure it out. I'll make it my personal mission to get you some skims. Yeah, we can send you some skims. I would love that so much. Okay. Are we an XL? XL in the drawers? I think I'm an L. Okay. Are we sure about that, honey?

Not 100%, but I'm going to go with that. I like a little bit. I like a little bit of tightness. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I heard that before. All right, on that note. On that note, thank you, Roddy. If you got a vein, show it off, brother. I'm with you, Roddy. Thank you, Roddy. You look cool. We appreciate it, man. Hopefully, see you soon. See you later. All right, better.